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Iudas
Disciple

Reged: 10/30/02
Posts: 1197
On the Naming of Families
      #2964658 - 08/24/04 08:33 AM

Is there any way to tell who an Argonian's parents or children might be?

The J', Z', Jo are honourifics correct? What follows the honourific is the family name?

For Orc's the Gra and Gro mean son of or daughter of?

All Bosmers last names are Ur? Dagoth Ur, Golagoth Ur, Fargoth Ur?

Redguards have only one name?

Darkelves follow the first name, family name convention? Ralen Hlaalu, Vedim Dren?

High Elves have only one name? Eldafire

Nords have either nicknames or full names?

Imperials follow the first name, family name convention?

Bretons ?

We at the Census and Excise Office are preparing the decennial census of Vvardenfell and need to ascertain the proper naming conventions for use with the new punch-stones method. Without the proper naming conventions, it will be impossible to process the War Tax Refund that the Emperor has decreed.

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MC_Stalker
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Reged: 08/25/03
Posts: 395
Loc: Black Light, gathering exhibits for Museum of Dwemer History
Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2964687 - 08/24/04 08:45 AM

Big D is Bosmer ? LOL ! Than I'm a cave rat.
And yes, Gra and Gro is really "son of" and "daugther of"

--------------------
Tamriel Rebuilt

From the point of view of banal erudition not every local personality can ignore tendentions of his paradoxal emotions in given time continuum.

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swrdphantom
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Reged: 08/28/03
Posts: 1525
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2964873 - 08/24/04 10:17 AM

I recently saw this over at The Imperial Library. It might help you a little bit.

--------------------
The middle, that's where you always are. There is neither begining and end, nor good and evil, there is only the middle.

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The New Morrowind Citadel

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Iudas
Disciple

Reged: 10/30/02
Posts: 1197
Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: swrdphantom]
      #2964958 - 08/24/04 10:51 AM

Almost perfect, the CE&O thanks you.
The only remaining questions then concerns the Khajiiti ( and isn't there always a question about them ) Male honourifics.
Dro', j', Ma', M', Qa', Ra', Ri', S', (Jo no apostrophe?).
Is there any appropriate transliteration of their meanings into Imperial terminology?


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MC_Stalker
Adept

Reged: 08/25/03
Posts: 395
Loc: Black Light, gathering exhibits for Museum of Dwemer History
Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2965033 - 08/24/04 11:17 AM

Yes. Here's the link - http://til.gamingsource.co.uk/interviews/jobasha.shtml

--------------------
Tamriel Rebuilt

From the point of view of banal erudition not every local personality can ignore tendentions of his paradoxal emotions in given time continuum.

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Iudas
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Reged: 10/30/02
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: MC_Stalker]
      #2965267 - 08/24/04 12:38 PM

Thank you. Now I feel like a right schmoo I was there earlier to read the other article and never thought to look at this one.

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Gleb
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Reged: 06/10/04
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2966215 - 08/24/04 05:14 PM

Originally, no, the Dunmer didn't go: Personal name---House name. The more Imperialized go like that. Fanatics like the Dres are more likely to go by House name---First name. Most will have the name of their ancestral Minor House instead of their Great House. I'm positive the Minor Houses still exist. For those in doubt, see the "Redguard Forum Madness" on TIL. It bears mention of House Dres, which probably existed until very recently (Tiber's time.).

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Iudas
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Gleb]
      #2967024 - 08/24/04 09:18 PM

When House Dres becomes a factor in the population of Vvardenfell, the Imperial Census and Excise Office will use the proper naming conventions for them.

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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2967551 - 08/25/04 12:25 AM

What are you talking about?

House Dres have a presence, they have at least one plantation, the way the dummer use their name does not come from a "proper naming convention" from a Imperial agency, Morrowind have home rule and the Imperial Census only keeps records of the people that live on a certain area, they just record names and not come with then.


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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: ]
      #2968004 - 08/25/04 04:10 AM

Fargoth.......Ur ( lol ) you are funny . Bosmers have only one name . Dagoth Ur is a corrupted chimer - the final bad guy in game.

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Iudas
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: ]
      #2968176 - 08/25/04 05:53 AM

The Dren family have a plantation on Vvardenfell.
House Dres has no representation on Vvardenfell, in Mournhold or on Solstheim yet.
There is a proper naming convention for each race determined by that races conventional usage, in an attempt to not offend by forcing an Imperial naming convention on the inhabitants, we were asking for clarification of what is the proper naming convention for each of the races.
After all sir, We are merely attempting to expedite the war tax refund to the inhabitants.

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Iudas
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: ]
      #2968188 - 08/25/04 06:02 AM

For some reason, there is no Dagoth Ur in the Imperial Tax Records. Nor is there any record for a V. Dagoth. There are however, many **goths listed as resident on Vvardenfell. We were merely attempting to ascertain if it was that Bosmer all had the same last name and so did not see a need to use it.
If you have information concerning a resident named D. Ur who has somehow managed to not pay his proper share of taxes for the War Effort, we at the CE&O would be most appreciative if you would forward such information with supporting proofs to the local representative Mr S. Ergola in Seyda Neen.
Just for further clarification, the Empire only levies taxes on Man, Mer, Orc, Khajiiti, and Argonian citizens. Owned beasts are of course considered as part of the wealth base for taxation but creatures are currently exempt from the Empires Tax reach

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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2969024 - 08/25/04 01:03 PM

Quote:

The Dren family have a plantation on Vvardenfell.
House Dres has no representation on Vvardenfell, in Mournhold or on Solstheim yet.





Neither does house Indril but ordinators are most from that house.

Neither Dren or Indril have a house presence in Vvardenfell great house council but then again that means nothing since most houses stick to their own areas of control.

As for Mornhold, its simply a part of Alamexia that as capital of Morrowind have the presence of all houses.

Solstheim is part of Skyrim and not Morrowind, its nord land.

Quote:


There is a proper naming convention for each race determined by that races conventional usage, in an attempt to not offend by forcing an Imperial naming convention on the inhabitants, we were asking for clarification of what is the proper naming convention for each of the races.




And as shown there is no "proper" naming convention, each sociaty have their own conventions but they are not a rule.


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Bobvorius
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Reged: 07/27/04
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: Iudas]
      #2969041 - 08/25/04 01:11 PM

Well, my friend, I might want to exchange some information for the burning of evidence of my tax evasion.

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Iudas
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Reged: 10/30/02
Posts: 1197
Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: ]
      #2969103 - 08/25/04 01:38 PM

Quote:

Neither does house Indril but ordinators are most from that house.



And for those ordinators for whom we can find names and who paid the war tax, the C&EO will be providing a war tax refund.

Quote:

Neither Dren or Indril have a house presence in Vvardenfell ...



The DREN family has a presence, indeed Duke Dren is the Imperial Plenipotentiary for Vvardenfell; House DRES has no presence.
The Vvardenfell office of the C&EO is responsible for Vvardenfell, Mournhold and Solstheim.

Each race or society does indeed have their own preferred and proper way of applying names to siblings and families, and that is indeed what the documents at TIL were able to help The C&EO to ascertain. We will be able to complete the census and should begin the process of delivering the War Tax refunds in short order.
But just to recapitulate:
Bosmers, Altmers, Khajiiti females and Redguards have only one name although they may ocassionally use a nickname or a location identifier. Nords usually go by only one name but sometimes may add a familial appelation or a defining nickname.
Orcs all have and follow a standard naming convention which specifies parentage.
Argonian names are approximations
Khajiiti male names have no familial meaning but the honourifics applied to the males do have a rigid hierarchical meaning.
Imperials and Bretons follow the First name Father's last name.
Dunmer use first name, family or house name, it is believed that in the past the order may have been reversed in some of the houses.




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Chimer_Warrior
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Reged: 04/11/04
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Re: On the Naming of Families [Re: ]
      #2969364 - 08/25/04 03:12 PM

Quote:

Quote:

The Dren family have a plantation on Vvardenfell.
House Dres has no representation on Vvardenfell, in Mournhold or on Solstheim yet.





Neither does house Indril but ordinators are most from that house.

Neither Dren or Indril have a house presence in Vvardenfell great house council but then again that means nothing since most houses stick to their own areas of control.

As for Mornhold, its simply a part of Alamexia that as capital of Morrowind have the presence of all houses.





Ordinators do NOT all come from Great House Indoril, and Great House Indoril is NOT present on Vvardenfell. The Minor Family House of Dren, which that of the Duke of Vvardenfell is part of, is part of Great House Hlaalu, with no ties or connections with Great House Dres anymore, althought possible a long time ago in the past.

The Dren Family is in no way connected to Great House Dres. Ordinators, other then possible family connections, are in no way connected to Great House Indoril.

--------------------
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